tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post7633755184606035741..comments2024-03-28T16:36:12.581-04:00Comments on Gurney Journey: "Decoration is a Sin"James Gurneyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01870848001990898499noreply@blogger.comBlogger59125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-78655635306848113022014-10-07T07:10:11.620-04:002014-10-07T07:10:11.620-04:00It is funny that I stumbled across this somehow on...It is funny that I stumbled across this somehow on the internet. As a student of design in the present it is very interesting to see other people's view on things he said. I am assuming that (from the comments I have read) that none of the people commenting were educated in art or design. <br /> Now for Frank Gehry; It is funny to me that he says this because when you actually pick apart a Frank Gehry building you realize that all the crazy forms flowing in and out are decoration. They are not necessary and therefore are some form of decoration. If you look into Danish design and designer such as Hans Wegner, Paul Kjaerholm, and Arne Jacobson you realise that minimalism is a very hard thing to do well. Their designs are beautiful, and world renowned, and true minimalism should be looked at where the form becomes the decoration. Take a look at any of their hand crafted chairs up close and you will see that decoration has been saved for only what is necessary. I.e. a joint in a leg, or the shape of the arm rest. If you look at the history of Danish design this came about because of WWII and their lack of new materials, so they learned to perfect form and create beauty in the details. Decoration is everywhere, but what I think he really means is that extra, unnecessary decoration is sin which agree or not good minimalism can be very beautiful if you really take a good look. Not the ugly schools and building created by some of todays architects. And yes, I believe Gehry is a Hypocrite.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00413351361876245338noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-87593649131571122392011-03-09T11:56:46.093-05:002011-03-09T11:56:46.093-05:00I just wanted to add that I agree with Walter Wick...I just wanted to add that I agree with Walter Wick's interpretation.<br /><br />He does not simply say 'decoration is sin'. He says, 'to me decoration is sin, because I adhere to the modernist philosophy, by which I was brought up'.<br /><br />I think it's a mistake to label all modernists as anti-traditional. I know plenty of modernist oriented people who love classical art, but considered it a bygone artform for a bygone society.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-52079856261260232702011-02-08T23:03:36.532-05:002011-02-08T23:03:36.532-05:00Something tells me Gehry was speaking in jest. Aft...Something tells me Gehry was speaking in jest. After all, saying something is "a sin," doesn't necessarily mean it's not enjoyable.Daniel Silberberghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08685707813625269747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-42481487748187947142011-02-01T19:58:23.706-05:002011-02-01T19:58:23.706-05:00If done right, I think decoration is a virtue.If done right, I think decoration is a virtue.Keith Parkerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14579786144772849547noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-78122508725806238912011-02-01T10:22:57.056-05:002011-02-01T10:22:57.056-05:00Yes, much over-the-top opulence in the Baroque too...Yes, much over-the-top opulence in the Baroque too. "born of" was a poor choice of words. Let's say the Garnier reflects the ambitions of a major European power in the 19th Century; the Fisher Center, that of a small college in upstate New York in the 21st. I think there is a correlation between the anti-ornamental aesthetic and Protestantism. Growing up in New England, with it's lightly ornamented, undecorated churches, factories and farms, one becomes accustomed to the aesthetic of pure shape and form. The phrase "decoration is a sin" does not seem particularly radical or modern to me.WWhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05873450855450455884noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-71755434355180761982011-02-01T08:08:39.255-05:002011-02-01T08:08:39.255-05:00No "over-the-top" opulence in the Baroqu...No "over-the-top" opulence in the Baroque? It seems obvious that opulence was always a legitimate goal prior to modernism. I think it's naive not to see a correlation between modernism's anti-ornamental aesthetic and Marxist philosophy, and that it has an unlikely bedfellow in Protestantism.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-89722240474467117252011-02-01T08:06:45.330-05:002011-02-01T08:06:45.330-05:00This comment has been removed by the author.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-46653530393085930022011-01-31T13:45:10.524-05:002011-01-31T13:45:10.524-05:00I have been to the Garnier, and it is indeed quite...I have been to the Garnier, and it is indeed quite an experience to attend an opera there. But it seems to me, even considering the classical roots of the architecture, the over-the-top opulence is born of its own place and time – 19th century Paris. I read Gehry's comment differently, simply as a declaration of his own place and time – the architectural style he most identifies with. His phrase, "decoration is sin", a tenet of that style, is added for emphasis, not as a value judgement for those of us who enjoy glorious traditions of the past. His comment helps us understand how his style emerged: if he had been concerned about niches, finials, and decorative trim, he could never have arrived at the sculpture forms he is now known for. In doing so, he may have traded one "sin" for another, but that is in the eye of the beholder. I'd like to see the Walt Disney Concert Hall someday. And consider this James, it has a built-in Gallery Flambeau!WWhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05873450855450455884noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-37368182892760528002011-01-31T12:16:10.822-05:002011-01-31T12:16:10.822-05:00To look at it: Police station? Warehouse? Church? ...<i>To look at it: Police station? Warehouse? Church? All of the above?</i><br />:)My Pen Namehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10163003696435139513noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-5316474973936659782011-01-31T04:53:37.567-05:002011-01-31T04:53:37.567-05:00Modernism is something today's uninspired/unta...Modernism is something today's uninspired/untalented designer (let it be a graphic designer, an architect, ...) can hide himself/herself behind, so that he/she can design the same tight and white shapes over and over again...<br /><br />For example when you look at modern interior design (we had an interior architect in our house yesterday for some improvements on our interior), you see that they all come up with the same interior solutions for e.g. the fireplace.<br />Inspiration and originality seems to be replaced by templated-based thinking...Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09055371808132473950noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-37591046766273422822011-01-31T04:38:11.048-05:002011-01-31T04:38:11.048-05:00The best architect that uses form with the structu...The best architect that uses form with the structural elements is Santiago Calatrava - in my opinion. Check out his structures...Harrisonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04022988378058699857noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-78384144348900549332011-01-31T02:58:25.172-05:002011-01-31T02:58:25.172-05:00The real problem with the Gehry "Center for t...The real problem with the Gehry "Center for the Performing Arts" (8 syllables where the simple "Opera" would do) is that it has no form following its function. To look at it: Police station? Warehouse? Church? All of the above?Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01850475222271022000noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-19987432862568343562011-01-30T17:52:01.971-05:002011-01-30T17:52:01.971-05:00Saying stupid things like "Decoration is a si...Saying stupid things like "Decoration is a sin" is a sin.kathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07157191667153531127noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-1282022022591723742011-01-30T15:57:36.549-05:002011-01-30T15:57:36.549-05:00His philosophy explains why Gehry's building a...His philosophy explains why Gehry's building aren't worth decorating. QED.Steven Khttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02696611705204591030noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-45432378283686588492011-01-30T09:52:42.739-05:002011-01-30T09:52:42.739-05:00Reading Loos' Wikipedia biography, it's ju...Reading Loos' Wikipedia biography, it's just too easy to dismiss his radical aesthetic as merely an extension of a radical personality.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-6053508176510289852011-01-30T02:02:15.175-05:002011-01-30T02:02:15.175-05:00I'd just like to put this in the context: Loos...I'd just like to put this in the context: Loos's essay about ornament being a crime was published in 1908, when "bad taste" in European architecture meant prefabricated pseudo-rennaisance everywhere. The form language of that architectonic style had degraded into mere trite convention. People like Loos and the Bauhas school wanted to swing the pendulum, go back to essential creativity in architecture and not let bad architects get away with covering their lack of skill by conventional ornament (or ivy ;). However, their minimalist aesthetic is these days as much an excuse for bad architects as was prefabricated ornament in their time.<br /><br />I spent ten years living in Brno, Czech republic, which has many first-wave modernist buildings by people like Loos or Miese van der Rohe. They are beautiful. They have genuine charisma, boldness, and purpose about them. I felt the aesthetic power of these buildings even when I was a child and knew nothing at all about art history. <br /><br />History of art is a history of reactions and finding a balance. The balance today is different than it was in 1908. Which is why Loos's idea sounds slightly out of place in the mouth of Mr. Gehry.Petr Moreshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15732837782055254155noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-14079538331679236912011-01-29T21:57:14.973-05:002011-01-29T21:57:14.973-05:00Mr Gurney you have never failed to post something ...Mr Gurney you have never failed to post something of unique relevance for the art community. This is probably one of the biggest problems that separate the art world, that is, the great disparity amongst the so-called "highbrow and lowbrow art". It has come to a point where some feel artistic beauty in some sense can be a sin~~Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15496163020252110592noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-6288716472185706992011-01-29T19:39:43.546-05:002011-01-29T19:39:43.546-05:00Oh please. Gehry's non-structural, non-functio...Oh please. Gehry's non-structural, non-functional forms are nothing <i>but</i> decoration.Tristan Elwellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16169919662214037416noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-44999423645886641902011-01-29T18:19:36.433-05:002011-01-29T18:19:36.433-05:00Modern architecture is mostly just dull to me. Lik...Modern architecture is mostly just dull to me. Like the common idea of work: forced efficiency with the fun of living ruled out. The Fisher Center looks like a warehouse with a wavy roof.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-52470657675762579452011-01-29T17:06:49.245-05:002011-01-29T17:06:49.245-05:00I'm not a big fan of Frank Gehry but he's ...I'm not a big fan of Frank Gehry but he's a modernist and this is how he was trained and his beliefs on what architecture should be and do reflect that philosophy. <br /><br />On a side note he designed a building for MIT which is now suing him for a long list of design flaws. The building leaks, and there are a host of other problems.jeffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03014751431677271423noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-21519791314047980972011-01-29T16:13:40.949-05:002011-01-29T16:13:40.949-05:00I love the decor on buildings! It's fun to try...I love the decor on buildings! It's fun to try and find all the little details.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08582307488954709425noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-57418844665606008002011-01-29T12:50:11.559-05:002011-01-29T12:50:11.559-05:00The view of the Fisher Center from the parking lot...The view of the Fisher Center from the parking lot is unfair to the structure. What a shame that is what is seen first! More accurate images of this unusual building can be seen by googling "Fisher Center images", or by going here: http://www.contemporist.com/2008/02/13/richard-b-fisher-center-for-the-performing-arts/<br />But in looking at Gehry's many wildly flamboyant designs, I wonder what on earth he means by "Decoration is sin"! A great many of his buildings are highly decorative, such as his Dancing Fish restaurant in Kobe, Japan...And Tiffany's has a line of Frank Gehry jewellry!Peggy Feltmatehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18120154108514761793noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-20047059113043164992011-01-29T12:25:39.311-05:002011-01-29T12:25:39.311-05:00One last point (sorry for multiple posts) it was P...One last point (sorry for multiple posts) it was Pugin, the great gothic revival architect, who came up with the modern idea of form and function - he thought it was ridiculous to build buildings intended for the climate of southern greece in England (classical architecture), in parts of England where, for example, brick was plentiful, he would design churches in with them. <br /><br />He also pointed out that much of what may seem decrative in gothic architecture is not- finials, for example helped add weight and support for flying buttresses. the decoration reflected or emphasized this, it wasn't just arbitrarily put on - and the decoration helped humanize the architecture.<br /><br />here is a famous pugin illustration contrasting the 'coldness' of the englightment vs the gothic:<br />http://blog.lib.umn.edu/zerot001/architecture/stuff%20011.jpgMy Pen Namehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10163003696435139513noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-20917872516555166542011-01-29T12:15:53.754-05:002011-01-29T12:15:53.754-05:00PS, I believe Ghery's buildings are nothing bu...PS, I believe Ghery's buildings are nothing but hyped up 'novelty architecture' like one found along Alantantic city in its amusement park days. He's also sort of 'branding' for the global elite... in twenty years, most people will hopefully recognize them for the eyesores they are.My Pen Namehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10163003696435139513noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2999230124118604245.post-47063024875971702232011-01-29T12:13:50.581-05:002011-01-29T12:13:50.581-05:00decoration is a sin, but creating useless, wastefu...decoration is a sin, but creating useless, wasteful, poorly designed buildings that<br />a. turn the sidewalks across the street to 140 degrees when the sun hits them <br />b. are hazards during the winter because they hurtle snow and ice on pedestrians (ohio)<br />c. give people vertigo (MIT, where he arrogantly disregarded prof's needs and wants so there is no private space - does HE work that way?) <br />d. design the building so poorly women are afraid to work there at night (same building) because ghery thought it would be great if people were 'surprised' by who was around the corner...<br />I really, really hate that guy, as a human being, as an architect.<br />In fact he is quite inhuman. both Kenneth Clark, and I believe, Jacob Collins, have pointed out that architecture has become remarkably inhumane since architects no longer train as artists.My Pen Namehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10163003696435139513noreply@blogger.com